Have you seen articles like this? I've known Jews that convert but usually not to Catholicism. Some join cults like Subud, which actually let you stay Jewish. Sometimes they become some kind of chanting, mystic Yogis. I've even known some Jews that become Pentecostal Protestants. I have known some Jewish guys who convert to Catholicism because they're having a lot of sex with a Catholic girl. I can see where that's kind of a religious experience but I don't think it's really an organized thing on the part of the Catholic Church. C'mon, conversion by the old pork sword is not as oppressive as conversion by a regular sword. It's not so permanent either. Plus. all of the Jews I've ever seen convert to anything else were secular Jews. None of them had any real religious affiliation and few if any real established beliefs about the nature of Deity.
In the real World, Catholics just aren't interested in converting Jews, religious or otherwise and it never happens. If they really worked at it, it would take a lot of time and effort on the part of the ever dwindling number of priests they have available. They still wouldn't get many souls and the ones they did get would likely turn out to be disruptive within the Catholic community. Too smart. Too many inappropriate questions. No humility. They'd get the sheeple on the kneeling rails all riled up. Can't have that.
The Catholic Church denies that they want to convert Jews. I believe them. Why would they? Doesn't make any sense. It seems to be the Jews that keep wanting to bring this topic up. It seems cruel, not that I mind at all and a wasted effort.
I am never concerned that Catholics want to convert me. Never even had one try. Maybe I should be offended that they don't consider me worthy. Nah, it's OK with me. My beef with Catholics and all other fundamentalist, scriptural literalist Christians, is that they want to break down the barriers between Church and State and impose their anachronistic moral codes, as civil law, on those of us actually living happily in the 21st century. I think the Jews should drop this obsession that Catholics are trying to convert them and join me in bashing all fundamentalist religion as subversive assholes and a threat to civil liberty.
4 comments:
There is a small community of Jews who are very anti-Catholic. They like to constantly "remind" us of the "crimes" of the Inquisition, and other controversies, including the Holocaust. Their feathers get ruffled anytime some bishop, or the Pope says something that might be miscontrued as anti-Jew.
There are indeed many Jews that have converted to Catholicism. Just do a search, and you'll see. Here's one site I found: Association of Hebrew Catholics (AHC)http://www.hebrewcatholic.org/index.html
It's not that we're interested in making converts. We're very interested in every soul. Catholics don't proseletyze the way that other Christian faiths do simply because the decision to become a Catholic shouldn't be one made in an emotional fervor. Most people who convert take up to a year or more attending classes, retreats, and other such things. Its a serious decision requiring serious thought, and should not be rushed into. Many times converts do so at the cost of their relationship with family and friends. Where's the tolerance, there?
For those such as yourself, who vehemtly oppose (and want to destroy) any religion, we know that talking may not be the most effective approach. We just simply try to earnestly live our life as an example of Christian peace, love, and charity. St. Francis of Assissi said, "Preach the Gospel at all times, and when necessary, use words."
Our moral codes are not "anachronistic". They are God's truth as He has revealed it to us. Truth is Eternal. Nobody is forcing you to live by them. You're not being persecuted by religious police, like they do in Islam. You're free to follow them or leave them at you're discretion.
However, secularism is being imposed upon those of us who believe. Let me go down the short list. Towns are being forced to change their seal. People are getting sued (by the oxymoronic ACLU) for saying Merry Christmas to you as you walk into WalMart. Plaques with those horrid Ten Commandments are being taken down, even though most of the world follows it more or less as its moral code. Kids can't say a prayer in school, but their freedom of speech is being taken away on the homosexual "Day of Silence".
If you feel these anachronistic moral codes are being imposed upon you, perhaps its the guilt you feel deep down inside you for not obeying the laws of God written in your heart. Real liberty comes in being free to love God and not be selfish.
The Pope and his Bishops do not believe in democracy. They've never said they do. They believe that all Catholics should be obligated to vote exactly the way they say.
If they had their way, there would be no divorce. Women would have no reproductive rights or the right to choose their own husbands. Gays that don't stay in the closet would be thrown in jail and ostracized from society. No business could be conducted on Sunday or Catholic holidays. The Catholic Church would be declared the state religion and be subsidized directly by the government. The Church would be designated the official provider of all social services. Catholic training would be required in all schools, which would be run by the Church. This is the way it was in Spain during the Catholic collaboration with the vile fascist dictator, Francisco Franco. It's the way it was until recently in Ireland. It's the way it was in many European countries until the end of World War II.
It's the way the evil little faggot, Ratzo Red Shoes, wants it to be again, everywhere.
I don't think it will ever happen. Most of the World has now freed itself from the grip of the Whore of Rome. Better safe than sorry though. Gotta keep pushing the old Pansy until he completely accepts the rights of all people to live the life they choose.
Catholics have always had nothing but contempt for our traditions of fair play, mutual respect and the rule of law. The Irish and Italians invented organized crime and corrupt government in this country. Even today, most of the huge traffic in narcotics that cripple our poor and youth is carried out by Catholic religionist cartels.
Most Catholics have freed themselves of the vileness that plagues leaders of their religion. Unfortunately, some have not.
Concerning the Spanish Inquisition:
Jews were never persecuted by the Spanish Inquisition. During the latter part of the 800 year long Reconquista, Most Sephardic Jews were either forced from Spain into North Africa or converted to Catholicism. It was cruel but not that bloody. When Spain finally was reunited under Ferdinand and Isabella, most of the Conversos were legitimately Christian. Most were doing well. Many were deeply entrenched within the highest ranks of the merchantile, military, aristocratic and even the ecclesiastical communities. The Conversos were a liberal influence on society, moving to bring the benefits of the Renaissance to the more feudal Spanish culture. Rome welcomed the influence of the Conversos. Ferd and Izzy, not so much. The Spanish Inquisition never bothered Conversos who remained loyal to the absolute power of the Spanish Crown, which is not the same as saying they didn't spend a lot of time fearing they might be "next" on the list. They'd have been foolish not to.
The Monarchy set up the Spanish Inquisition to shore up their own conservative power base. It was never sanctioned or encouraged by Rome. Most Conversos were not "secretly" practicing Judaism and most never went back to being Jews. Even today, genetic markers for Jewish ancestry among the general population of Spain are the highest in the World. They might be as high as Israel. Many powerful, liberal, non Jewish luminaries were labeled Conversos falsely and rubbed out. The Inquisition was pretty select about who they prosecuted and the reasons were never really related to religion but politics. It's commonly thought that large numbers of people died during this period and maybe thy did but Torquemada didn't kill them.
When the Inquisition went to the New World, it served the same purpose that it had in Spain, to consolidate power, political, economic and social in the hands of the monarchy, just as it had in Spain. Did a good job, too.
If a religious belief system is determined by democracy, it can never remain consistent. It will change with the wind, and therefore become irrelevant to the believers.
Read the Catechism of the Catholic Church, and other Church documents concerning marriage, divorce, homosexuality, and abortion. Abortion is murder, and there's no way you can get around that given the state of today's medical science. No where does anything say that a woman is not free to choose her husband. That's ludicrous and baseless. According to the Church, a marriage that was coerced is invalid, and has grounds for annullment.
The Church could never be declared the state religion - our country was founded on religious freedom. You have mentioned this before, yet the opposite is what is actually occuring.
I see nothing wrong with Catholic hospitals. They would do a good job, as they are doing currently. They practice the right choice - respect for life in all its stages. A government hospital would deliver care with the compassion of the IRS. Of course, the government run schools have done a great job in providing a quality education, as well as instilling virtues and values. Catholic social services already exist, and do a far better job than the government. Again, if americans didn't have to carry the tax burdens to pay for government theft in the form of welfare, Catholic service organizations would flourish. Peoples bodies, minds, and souls would be taken care of. You don't see social workers going out into the slummiest of slums, picking up the homeless and poorest of the poor and restoring their human dignity with love and care.
Ah, the "Whore of Rome", that old canard tossed about by anti-Catholic evangelicals. You say you're not anti-Catholic? Do you talk this way around your Catholic friends? If you do, and they're still your friends, you might want to think about why they would stick around to listen to your hate. Do you start conversations with your Catholic friends with "Hey, guess what that evil faggot Popo Ratzo said today"?
People already have the right to choose the way they want to live. Its called free will, and God gave it to us. God doesn't force anybody to love Him. If He did, the love He would get wouldn't be real. You want to reject God? Go ahead. Its been going on since Adam and Eve. You can choose, for "a man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still". You frequently mention how the Church and Christianity tries to force themselves on you. Are you being harassed by the Christian religious police? I think not, but you don't rail against the Islamic religious police who kill women for being raped. If you have, then its completely lopsided in favor of Islam. So, if you feel this way, perhaps it s due to a deep, subconscious guilt you feel for not doing the right thing in your life. Maybe you should investigate the possibility of repenting, if your pride and your ego will let you. Easier said than done, I will admit.
People who create and operate criminal organizations do not do so with the sanction of the Church. They also use the Church to hide behind. They victimize everybody and anybody they can. They will take advantage of the Christian's unwillingness to stoop to the criminals low methods to defend themselves. It has no reflection of the Church. There were probably corrupt priests, but that shouldn't reflect on the Church any more than corrupt Italians or Irish or south Americans should reflect against all of them. Again, you're painting with a very broad brush.
All the stuff above I've said is not hard to find. A quick google usually does the trick. Having served on submarines, I know you're an intelligent guy. That being said, I can't understand why you continue to repeat old, worn misconceptions and lies when the information is so freely and easily available. In the spirit of charity, I won't speculate here as to why you do.
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